They're a really fun exact mix of the two parents, with a lot of copper-to-red emergent, varying amounts of vein contrast (subsignatum x pap Marie has none at all), and golden to cream colored veins on a lot of them. They're vigorous growers, very dark, mean-looking, mostly sub-velvet in texture: more towards subsi Marie than papillilaminum velvet. I haven't really found any wide sinus ones in this cross, which makes sense because subsi x Marie isn't a wide sinus plant: it's mean-looking but not flat.